POLICE SHOOTING: BELIEVING IS, SEEING, SOMETIMES IS BELIEVING

cockalorum101 Says:

Mar 3, 2012 - It is not laughing at the end of the video, rather a "YOW!" Holy Shit Batman type of spontaneous expression from a bystander witness or from a window or balcony.But thanks Sherlock for your reply and comments. It's practically impossible to view all the details in the fast ten second video so you have to view is several times to see the suspect's hand reach behind, to watch the rear cop's gun blasts, the hand gun flying from the hand, falling next to victim, etc lol

K9Elvis Says:

Mar 3, 2012 - I get all of that - that's the whole purpose of the video is to SHOW that what you see and what happens are two different things. But what you DONT see is a muzzle flash from the rear guy. If he REALLY shot, there'd be a pronounced muzzle flash. Have you ever been in a shootout? I have - I'll guarantee you that if there's a muzzle pointed TOWARDS you (even on an angle) you're going to see the flash. You'll never forget it. It will haunt you. FAKE -

cockalorum101 Says:

Mar 3, 2012 - The muzzle fire can be seen in the first and second shot but more clearly visible from the second shot which is seen more clearly when the gun has the dark background of the bullet proof vest, methinks.

K9Elvis Says:

Mar 3, 2012 - Nope - that's a little white dot. Have a friend go somewhere you can shoot - have him stand 20 feet away from you and then shoot a 9mm or larger pistol towards your right shoulder. Watch and video that muzzle blast. A true muzzle blast is a pronounced event. There's approximately 350 foot pounds of pressure at the muzzle. And for the record - I watched it frame by frame in my video editing suite. Still makes no difference.

cockalorum101 Says:

Mar 3, 2012 - I think you are comparing live ammunition consisting of a tightly packed lead piston with a 350 foot pounds of muzzle pressure instead of a loosely fitting hollywood blank that has hardly any foot pounds of pressure and practically demands acting the recoil to mimick the kickback.

K9Elvis Says:

Mar 3, 2012 - OK...you have me confused. Are you saying the video is REAL or are you saying that the video is FAKE? I say it's fake. What say you? 

GalileoTheGreater Says:

Mar 3, 2012 - I agree with you that the video is a fake; a setup possibility for training purposes. Although I am curious why the uploader emphasized that this was the Real Deal. Propaganda at best. I would like to see the news story and link that proves otherwise. Moral of the story, don't trust perception, don't trust suspects, always have back up, cover your butt, don't let your guard down even when you think you can. etc etc

K9Elvis Says:

Mar 3, 2012 - I searched - this video has been floating around since at least 2009 with everyone making the same claims for either a real or fake video - never have been able to find a source.

GalileoTheGreater Says:

Mar 3, 2012 - Thanks I never saw it before but I was actually duped by it at first allowing for my initial reaction to flow which is to trust that people tell you the truth. But alas, your comment made me awake to the fact that obfuscation seems to be the deceiver's first rule of thumb, reminds me of religion and the clergy actually and charlatans of the supernatural. lol

K9Elvis Says:

Mar 3, 2012 - Just so you know...obfuscation is not only in the realm of the deceiver - the bad guys teach each other moves like that in the prison systems - there's a scary trick that the cons teach each other if practiced, one can grab the slide on a police officer's Glock handgun and simultaneously pinch/squeeze/slide release levers while sliding the action backwards and in effect - disassemble the gun while it's in the officer's hand - leaving them defenseless.

GalileoTheGreater Says:

Mar 3, 2012 - That would be pretty awesome to have happen to a law enforcer The only thing I know about guns is when I was a teenager and we went hunting partridges, rabbits and squirrels with a 28 guage shotgun; OMG that was cruel enough every time I think about it. I've never shot a hand gun.

Hambone571 Says:

Mar 6, 2012 - You'll notice the front officer didn't appear to fire his weapon, only the one in the rear who saw the threat/gun as the suspect was pulling it out. He then fired. Momentun of suspect appears to make hips go forward, while torso went backward looking as tough the "shot" came from the front. Hence your no "hits/blood seen on shirt. Its on the rear.

Packerfan12100 Says:

Mar 31, 2012 - notice after hes shot there is another gun in his right hand....they did the right thing!

invar1 Says:

Apr 28, 2012 - It's a staged/training video. No cop holsters up immediately following a shooting, especially when there are guns laying directly next to the body. Trust me on this.

LeoTheGreater Says:

Apr 28, 2012 - Everyone seems to know that this is a staged event but not for the reason you state; there are obvious, more plausible reasons that what you give.

invar1 Says:

Apr 28, 2012 - You think my reason is implausible? Trying asking a few cops what they think. The cop in the foreground immediately lowers his gun, is no longer covering the guy, not even in a depressed state, and begins advancing on him. Maybe he just has really bad tactics... but it's much more likely that he walks up to him to assess afterwards because he knows the scenario ended.

LeoTheGreater Says:

Apr 28, 2012 - I am not saying your reason is implausible; what I am saying is that, that is not the main reason people believe it is staged, on the other hand you seem to think the front cop fired on the guy. Is that what you think?

invar1 Says:

Apr 28, 2012 - No, I don't think he fired. But anyway, I only listed one of the reasons which immediately stood out to me. Here are a few others:Cop in foreground doesn't react to the shots. Studies have been done on this. He shows absolutely no "mass reflexive response". Look it up. In short, shots are fired, the perp flails, the front cop's brain would've caused him to fire also. It doesn't have time to process everything and see what we see and stop him from firing.

invar1 Says:

Apr 28, 2012 - People said the guy flopped the wrong direction based on the direction rounds came from. Here's an interesting fact: bullets don't fling people around. Look at footage of people that are actually being shot. They don't flail or spin around. That only happens if the person is actually in fast motion already. This guy was crouching and moving slowly.

invar1 Says:

Apr 28, 2012 - There's no muzzle flash. Saw someone mention that before. That's a real reason.

LeoTheGreater Says:

Apr 28, 2012 - The first obvious is deception of the guy shot is that he fell backwards, giving the impression that the front cop fired but it was the back cop who fired because the back cop saw that the criminal reached into his rear pocket for a handgun as he placed his rifle on the ground; the front cop could not see this action but

LeoTheGreater Says:

Apr 28, 2012 - the back cop did see it and fired at the criminal which you can see caused the crook to jettison the handgun and it fell alongside him. BUT the criminal should have fallen forward when shot from the rear, not backward.

LeoTheGreater Says:

Apr 28, 2012 - The back cop's gun shows two fast muzzle flashes, the front none.

invar1 Says:

Apr 28, 2012 - No. Again, people don't fall in the same direction of a bullet. That really has little to nothing to do with it. That's something that people picked up from watching movies. They do it for dramatic effect. You could get shot by a shotgun SLUG and the mass of the slug coupled with the tremendous force wouldn't be enough to actually cause you to fly backwards. Simple physics. Most of the force in the slug goes towards tissue penetration and damage, NOT body movement.

LeoTheGreater Says:

Apr 28, 2012 - I think natural reflex may take some credit for falling front, back or sideways; otherwise, collapsing where you stand would probably be the natural style.More importantly though other than the subtleties of the stage and props, is the moral of the story, the training event was a demonstration of and that was.............?